Professor David Peimer
An American in Paris
Professor David Peimer - An American in Paris
- I’ve been asked- Trudy and, you know, wanted just something a little bit lighter. So we thought “An American in Paris,” some of Gershwin, some other things would just, you know, capture a little bit of a different mood, you know, to put it one way, obviously. And the remarkable music of Mr. Gershwin, which never fails to astonish me, to be frank, listening to it again and again and again. It just never fails. So I hope we can enjoy this hour together, and we’re going to primarily focus on Gershwin’s music and obviously the movie in particular, but some other pieces, some other of the remarkable classics and brilliance of his composing in a couple of other pieces as well. Okay. If we can show the first slide. Please, Lauren. Okay, thank you. So “An American in Paris,” and on the right hand side we see the- this is from the original poster of the Vincent “Vincente” Minnelli, as everybody knows, Liza Minnelli’s father, his production, his film, 1951 film of the production, which Gershwin obviously wrote and did way before the war. And with Gene Kelly, Leslie Caron, Oscar Levant, et cetera. So the original, which, but where Minnelli changed a little bit of the story, made it slightly more appropriate for post-war, in terms of the story of the Gene Kelly GI soldier character. On the left hand side is fascinating. This is a quite a contemporary dance production, which was done about 10 years ago in New York and in London in particular. And it was entirely dance, and where they used dance in only to interpret the entire production. So there was no, I suppose, acting without dance.
Basically dancing and singing all the way through. And what’s interesting to me is the different images of the posters. On the left hand side, the very contemporary one, you know, looking at the Eiffel Tower, the sort of maybe schmaltzy, maybe half schmaltzy image of the lovers, you know, Paris, the city of love and romance and passion. And on the right hand side, a celebration of the French, you know, the colours in the back, but the image of Gene Kelly, Leslie Caron, quite differently portrayed in emphasising the dance and the American aspect in Paris. And a kind of celebratory mood that he’s giving it, Minnelli. On the left hand side of, I think, a slightly more sober and maybe even thoughtful, dance interpretation. Yeah, I don’t want to read too much in it, but it’s just interesting to me that even though this is over half a century later, the dance production interestingly was so popular and, you know, they, people loved it. And I’m going to, I’m going to propose that it all goes down to Gershwin’s music. I really think it does. And, to a degree, the lyrics of his brother, and of course some of the story that Alan Jay Lerner did. Okay, if we could go on to the next slide, please. So this is obviously Gershwin, and I’m sure- I’m not going to go too much into the life because I’m sure everybody out there knows so much about his life and so much of the detail. And because I want to spend time on the production, and on a couple of other pieces as well, I’m going to just do for me a couple of highlights of his life, this extraordinary composer, and I mean it in the sense of the word of the 20th century music, the combination of jazz and classical.
His ability as the outsider, and I’m going to propose, the outside the Jewish character, outside a Jewish person, to really get inside how jazz really works, not only in terms of music and music structure, but in terms of the zeitgeist and culturally linking up with African-American trajectory and African-American history, in a way, to be able to get so inside. And I’m going to play a little bit of Ella, of Ella Fitzgerald and Louis Armstrong playing, you know, two of his pieces later. And you can just feel it so deep. So I think he’s got a cultural handle on what’s going on inside African-American culture, and he’s bringing that together with jazz and some approaches of classical and melody. And of course, understanding, you know, so well the basics of lyrics, certainly Ira is, and Alan Jay Lerner with the story and dialogue. So, Gershwin, as I said, he’s really combining jazz and classical, and his best known works, I’m sure everybody knows “Rhapsody in Blue,” 1924 he writes it. He’s 26 years old when he wrote the 18-minute “Rhapsody in Blue.” So I’m going to play a few minutes off a little bit later. An amazingly, for me, beautiful piece of music. It’s 98 years ago he wrote it. Let’s just think of that. It’s a century ago that he wrote it, and yet it is still, for me, so moving and so evocative, you know, and just beautifully written. “An American in Paris,” he wrote it in 1928. 1928. It’s also nearly a hundred years ago. And yet some of those songs are still so powerful.
The dancing of Gene Kelly, of course. “Swanee,” which was the very first hit that he had with Al Johnson. I mean, this goes way back over a century. “Porgy and Bess,” which he wrote in 1935, which of course is one of the all-time most memorable, evocative, emotionally seductive, pieces of music and lyrics. “Summertime,” which I’m going to play Ella Fitzgerald and Louis Armstrong singing and playing it. And this is- I guess what I really want to emphasise is how many really last over a century. A century later, these songs are still, you can conjure them up in less than a heartbeat. For me, an extraordinary achievement for a guy and at this age of his life. Yeah, he’s- and he died so young, tragically. He died at the age of 39, tragically so young, of a brain tumour, as far as we know, you know, pretty much. So Gershwin comes from- just briefly a little bit about his biography. Russian Jewish ancestry. His grandfather, interestingly, Jacov Yako-, sorry, Gershowitz was born in Odesa, as we all know, of course, in the Ukraine. And his grandfather had served in as a mechanic for the Imperial Russian army for 25 years. And he did it, as I’m sure many people listening, and many people around the world have a similar family trajectory and history, 25 years, he works as a mechanic, where he serves as a mechanic in the Imperial Russian army. And that then gives him the right to free travel and residence as a Jew. So we all know these stories so well, I’m sure, so many, my grandfather’s similar, and I’m sure many of you everywhere. 25 years in the Russian Tsars army, in order to have residence, in order to be accepted, possibly as a part-time citizen in Russia, in order to be allowed to exist, et cetera. The story that we all so many of us inherit, and extraordinary to think of that, you know, is the line. His grandfather retired near St. Petersburg. His teenage son, Moishe, was Gershwin’s father. Moishe. Okay, so Moishe is his own father, who is the teenage son. And he worked as a leather cutter on shoes, primarily.
And his father meets his mother, Rosa, in Vilnius in Lithuania. And they decide, she and her family first moved to New York City because, obviously, of everything going on in Russia at the time. So anti-Jewish in so many ways, which we all know the stories. She changes her first name from Rosa to Rose. And Moishe is- she goes first to New York, and then he’s faced with compulsory military service in Russia, et cetera, and goes to America. And he changed his first name to Morris. So this… Then Gershwin, he wrote “Rhapsody in Blue” for orchestra and piano, combining jazz and classical primarily, I suppose, in pretty revolutionary ways, in very innovative, remarkably innovative ways. The other thing about him, for me, as the outsider, he’s able to get at such a young age, to get something of the American zeitgeist of the immigrant, obviously, the immigrant Jewish carer person, the outsider, the foreigner coming in and trying to get to grips with- trying to understand the, his new culture that he’s born into in a way. And he gets it at such a young age, I think. “Rhapsody in Blue,” “Porgy and Bess,” I mentioned, “Strike Up a Band,” you know, all of these remarkable pieces, which he’s written. Then in the mid 20s, he went to live in Paris for a while, and that’s actually where he wrote “An American in Paris.” Although the Minnelli movie, as we all know, is set after the war, so he’s, you know, he’s a GI, the Gene Kelly character is a GI, you know, he stays on, et cetera.
You know, a small change in the story, it’s not a big deal, that Alan Jay Lerner makes. But he writes it in Paris. For me, what’s interesting is that, “Porgy and Bess,” “An American in Paris,” and some of the other works, is all outsider. Even the work of trying to really get to grips with jazz, coming through the African-American trajectory, is the outsider absorbing all these influences, as any great artist will do, absorb the tradition, absorb the influences from everywhere, and then take it a whole big step further. For me, that’s what Dylan does, Elvis, Leonard- So many of the great artists, they stand on the shoulders of those who’ve gone before. And, you know, in the essay by T.S. Eliot, “Tradition and the Individual Talent,” “You stand on the shoulders of tradition and take it further.” But he’s also an immigrant. And I think that’s where the Jewishness comes in as well, to take it further. Okay. What’s interesting is that when you, when they first staged the stage version, not the film, “An American in Paris, first performance was at Carnegie Hall, and it was very mixed reviews. When you look back on them, it’s quite interesting, it’s fascinating. The reviews are so mixed, there’s no raving or analysis or trying to understand any of this. Don’t get it, what he’s really doing, contributing to the remarkable growth of musical theatre in America or globally. This all comes later. And "Porgy and Bess” is a commercial flop. He then moved to Hollywood, and 1936, he’s working with Fred Astaire, Ginger Rogers, et cetera. And apparently his last words before he died were “Fred Astaire.” Whether it makes any- has any extra meaning or not, I don’t want to read more into it than we need to. He had a 10-year affair with the composer, Kay Swift, never married, and she helped him a lot with his compositions and almost worked together in a way.
Then finally, of course, the tragic illness and the brain tumour at the tender age of 39. He’s achieved so much, not only in the composing, the writing, the piano concertos, more- which are, you know, shifting the jazz classical fusion in a way. So long ago he’s doing this. Such early days, the jazz, the rhythms, the melodies, the classical. He’s intrigued and loved Shostakovich, Stravinsky. 2007, the Library of Congress created the Gershwin Prize of Popular song. And 2007, who’s the first winner of the prize? Paul Simon. Interestingly, the soundtrack- there, so many references, I just want to highlight a few. The soundtrack to Woody Allen’s 1979 movie, “Manhattan,” is composed entirely of Gershwin compositions, including, of course, the great, great classic, “Rhapsody in Blue.” I mean, you know, the artists later are doing exactly what he did, absorbing, taking, like Woody Allen and others, taking it much further. In 2010, Brian Wilson, the genius for me behind the Beach Boys, released “Brian Wilson Reimagines Gershwin.” 2010, consisting of 10 Gershwin songs, including “Rhapsody in Blue.” So the influence, these are just a few little highlights, of how the cultural influence keeps moving. What he gains from those gone before, he gives. And then Paul Simon, Brian Wilson, so many others take him so much further afterwards. Okay, if we can go onto the next slide, please, Lauren? Thank you. So Alan Jay Lerner, those are his dates, of course.
And obviously, you know, he’s Jewish as well. He, Alan Jay Lerner, interestingly, who wrote the book for “An American in Paris,” he won three Tony Awards and three Academy Awards in his lifetime. That’s a massive- I mean, that’s an extraordinary achievement for a writer. Huge. Born in New York, father was Samuel Lerner, and his uncle, sorry, was Samuel Lerner, who was the founder of Lerner Stores, a chain of dress shops. And interestingly, Lerner was much more sort of university path. And he was a classmate of JFK and I suppose like Cole Porter studied at Yale, Richard Rogers studied at Columbia. And you know, he also began with collegiate contributions and collegiate compositions and work. Lerner studied primarily at Julliard, as I’m sure many know. And of course, the great, great classic that he wrote together with Lou, 1956, the great “My Fair Lady,” and many, many others. Maurice Chevalier, et cetera. This, he wrote the script for “American in Paris.” Okay. And the lyrics were written by Ira. Okay, if we can go onto the next slide, please. Thank you. Okay, here’s the brilliant, fantastic brother, Ira Gershwin, who luckily for us, I guess, lived, you know, a good, much longer life, and the two brothers working so closely and so much together. But the remarkable thing for me is George Gershwin and the contribution to the music. The story of the film, for me it’s primarily it’s dance pieces. Gene Kelly choreographed some, et cetera, and so on. But it’s primarily, it’s the music, and this idea of the outside of coming in. But for me, Gershwin’s music is absolutely what, not just the glue, but it’s for me, the goal, the gem of the entire piece. And then the climax, of course, is a ballet, which is a 17-minute, dialogue-free dance piece with Gene Kelly and Leslie Caron. 17-minute dance piece.
I mean, to do in those days, in any day, a 17-minute dance piece in a film? Sorry, in a musical? Quite incredible. So it cost of fortune to stage. So the “An American in Paris” won six academy awards, including for Best Picture and so on. I’m sure we all know the story of it, you know, the GI and the triangle, the classic triangle, the GI falls in love with a girl. Gene Kelly falls in love with Leslie Caron, but she’s already betrothed, or going to be betrothed to Henri, the other character, the French character. And then we much later discover that Henri helped her during the war to escape the clutches of the Gestapo and so on. So she feels obliged to marry him after the war and stay with him out of, I suppose, obligation, duty, although she’s fallen in love with the Gene Kelly character. Essence classic triangle story with a little bit of that background of the war, which Vincent Minnelli and Alan Jay Lerner put into the version of the original that George Gershwin created before the war. Okay? The film earned 3.7 million dollars in North America, 3.2 million dollars globally. This is the beginning of the 1950s, and was about 1.3 million profit. 2006, the AFT voted it the ninth greatest movie musical of all time. Is it dated? Does it have charm? Is it just an exotically contrived romance? Is it schmaltzy? Is it a little bit of schmaltz, a little bit of exotica, a little bit of romance? Does the music take it into another transcendent level entirely?
Open all these questions for us all. I’m celebrating Gershwin as the artist really, coming from the outsider, the immigrant, the foreigner absorbing so much of American culture, of African-American history, of the musical history of America, musical theatre, and taking it a huge step forward in terms of the art of composition, of classical and jazz, and other rhythms and melodies. And in addition, what he’s able to put in to create an incredibly memorable sound. Not only songs, but the sound for me is so unbelievably memorable that, you know, you get people humming it anywhere in the world, everywhere all the time. Okay. And then, there’ve been many West End Productions and Tony and Broadway productions, which have won awards and played for ages and so on. Okay, what I’d like to do is if we can play the first piece, please? And this is the opening scene from the movie where, with Gene Kelly and the opening scene.
CLIP BEGINS
This is Paris, and I’m an American who lives here. My name, Jerry Mulligan, and I’m an ex-GI. In 1945, when the army told me to find my own job, I stayed on. And I’ll tell you why. I’m a painter. All my life, that’s all I’ve ever wanted to do. And for a painter, the mecca of the world for study, for inspiration, and for living, is here on this star called Paris. Just look at it. No wonder so many artists have come here and called it home. Brother, if you can’t paint in Paris, you better give up and marry the boss’s daughter. We’re on the left bank now. That’s where I’m billeted. Here’s my street. The past couple of years I’ve gotten to know practically everyone on the block, and a nicer bunch you’ll never meet. Back home, everyone said I didn’t have any talent. They might be saying the same thing over here, but it sounds better in French. I live upstairs. No, no, no, not there. One flight up. Voila.
Jerry!
Jerry!
[Kid] Jerry!
[Jerry] Those are three of my pals. Etienne, Maurice, and Jacques. I’m their man because I give them American bubble gum. Oh, I have a lot of good friends in Paris. A lot of very good friends.
CLIP ENDS
- Thank you very much. Okay. So this is obviously the opening. Gene Kelly. What I like is the influence of some of the really- the painters and Toulouse-Lautrec and others, in the tiny detail with a set, you know, and the way that such a small little space is just naturally assumed and, you know, he’s just making it into his own and bigger space. And secondly, the boldness of just saying, “This is Paris, I am, et cetera, Jerry Mulligan.” It’s just telling us straight what it is, who we are, and let’s get on with the story. And I think far less bold writers than Alan Jay Lerner would begin with this kind of thing. Let’s never forget, this is a guy who wrote “My Fair Lady.” So yeah, there’s something really going on as, okay, he’s writing the script, he’s not writing the lyrics, but he understands to help to tell a story. That’s what I really want to get at. And when you’ve got Alan Jay Lerner on how to tell a story, Gershwin on music, and his brother with lyrics, I think you’ve got a pretty lethal combination. Okay, could we show the next one, please? This is one of the great scenes which I love, no matter how many times I watch. “I Got Rhythm.”
CLIP BEGINS
I got! ♪ Rhythm ♪
I got! ♪ Music ♪
I got! ♪ My gal, who could ask for anything more ♪
I got! ♪ Daisies ♪
I got! ♪ In green pastures ♪
I got! ♪ My gal, who could ask for anything more ♪ ♪ Old man trouble ♪ ♪ I don’t mind him ♪ ♪ You won’t find him round my door ♪
No!
I got! ♪ Rhythm ♪
I got! ♪ Music ♪
I got! ♪ My gal, who could ask for anything more ♪ ♪ Who could ask for anything more ♪ ♪ Who could ask for anything more ♪ ♪ Who could ask for anything more ♪ ♪ Old man trouble ♪ ♪ I don’t mind him ♪ ♪ You won’t find him ♪ ♪ Hanging round my door ♪ No!
I got!
Rhythm!
Yeah! I got!
Music!
Yeah! I got!
My gal! ♪ Who could ask for anything more ♪ ♪ Who could ask for anything more ♪
Say “le time step”.
Le time step.
Ah, oui! Le time step. Say “le shim sham.”
Le shim sham!
Ah! Charleston!
Charleston!
Choo choo train!
Soldier!
Soldier!
Napoleon! Cowboy!
Cowboy!
Hop along Cassidy!
Yeah!
Charlie!
Charlie Chaplin!
Aeroplane! ♪ Who could ask for anything more ♪
CLIP ENDS
- Thanks, Lauren. What I love here is obviously the dancing is such fun and just joyous and just a relishing celebration of just dance and fun. But also it is Gene Kelly is not just doing it as a virtuoso to show off his own brilliance as a dancer, but he’s relating to these kids all the time and they are raptured, riveted with him. And you get all their, like little kids sing, wiping her hair, you know, wiping her face and nose and other things. All the little natural gestures that the kids would do. So they’re not just acting, they’re being natural as well, in the moment. Gene Kelly never forgets that the main focus is not the virtuosity and brilliance of his dancing and the, even the choreography, but to relate to the kids all the time. It’s, you know, one of the great cliches of acting, acting is relating, acting is reacting, feeding off each other all the time. It’s relational, it’s a relationship. And I love how Gene Kelly always through his eyes, his body is always engaging with the chemistry with the kids. And, you know, and they’re just so giving with him in all their little ways. And it’s Minnelli’s choice that they take, you know, “I got,” they take the first two words and interact in that way. Taking Gershwin and the lyrics and the music taking, just pushing it that whole for me, beautiful step forward.
Okay, if we could do the next, please, please. And this is just taking a side step away from “An American in Paris.” And this is a couple of minutes of, for me, one of the great pieces of the 20th century composition, “Rhapsody in Blue.” Hear that? Okay. Thanks Lauren. I just, you know, it’s interesting, not only ‘cause Woody Allen used it in “Manhattan,” but for me, it just never fails to be so, so moving, to have such depth, to have such a contrast that, you know, he’s moving from jazz to classical, to melody, so many different things. And with the instruments and playing with, it’s almost like a couple of strands of thought going through at the same time that there’s such variation coming from the high and the top and then down below. There’s no time to get into whole musical analysis, but for me, it’s just beautiful, and remains one of the great pieces of the century. Okay. Going back to “An American in Paris,” the very influential and very intelligent and wonderful American critic, Roger Ebert, in 1992 wrote a review of the Minnelli movie, the 1951 Minnelli movie of “An American in Paris.” And he wrote, and Ebert wrote, “It’s a corny story of love won, love lost, and won again. It’s a pretty- it’s pretty tame stuff.” I want you to give you that because, what’s important is that he was not accepted by everybody at all. The Minnelli movie and Gershwin in the music, it’s all seen as schmaltzy, as contrived romantic silliness, almost, almost naivety, childish. But I don’t think, as I said, we’re saying at the beginning, for me, they don’t give appreciation and recognition to the brilliance of the music. And the music alone and the lyrics make it transcend.
And that outsider idea, “Porgy and Bess,” African-American tradition, summertime songs, and others and how he’s pulling it all together. And even with Gene Kelly, “I Got Rhythm.” You know, he’s finding something new in the American musical theatre tradition of his times when he’s doing most of this. Beginning, you know, primarily in the 30s, and then going through 40s into the 50s writing, composing. I disagree with Roger. It may be tame on a surface level, pretty tame stuff as Roger Ebert writes. But there’s something underneath. And to me it’s not just schmaltzy nostalgic memory. I think there’s something much more, simple human joyousness, and my God, I think we all could do it with a bit of dose. You know, not only now, but anytime. Okay. Could we play the next one, please? This is a couple of minutes of the love dance between Gene Kelly and the Leslie Caron character in “An American in Paris,” in the '51 Minnelli movie. Okay, thanks Lauren. So for me, what’s happening here is that, again, I’m going to go back to Roger Ebert’s phrase. It’s, to me, it’s, yes, of course it’s tame. Yes, of course it’s maybe nostalgic and romantic, et cetera. But why not, firstly? And secondly, I think what takes it a whole huge step further is that, number one, they never lose sight of each other again, it’s not the virtuosity of other one’s dance, it’s a chemistry between the two, an emotional, sexual, deep chemistry between them.
Secondly, I think that there is a grace, a charm. You know, Hemingway once said, “Courage is grace under pressure.” Fascinating. And Hemingway said that, “Courage is grace under pressure.” And you look at when people are under pressure, they’re not under pressure, of course they’re falling in love, but the role of grace, and how grace plays such a role in certain human, in certain ways of human interaction. Of course, a sensuality, maybe of falling in love, maybe not, maybe just a friendship, maybe with a child, a grandparent, whoever, a moment of grace at this time of year, when I watched this, that’s what strikes me. Even though this is done, you know, over 70 years ago, it’s choreographed and filmed and there’s a certain sadness, a certain melancholy, but all in all a grace and a charm. There’s a fantastic movie and I couldn’t remember the name of it, where Brando is much older and very overweight, extremely overweight, but he dances, and there is a grace that he dances. Brando dances with such a grace and I think it’s a lost art, to a certain degree, but certain artists really understand. Here, of course, it’s been pushed and I’m pushing it much more, but I think when one has it, one can have extraordinary moments that just take it out of being schmaltz and kitsch. Okay, and it is because of these ways of them dancing like this. Okay, if we could do the next piece, which is very different, the “Tra-la-la” song with Gene Kelly and Oscar Levant, a wonderful pianist. He comes back and tells him he’s falling in love, of course.
CLIP BEGINS
♪ Tra la la la la la ♪ ♪ Tra la la la ♪
One’s company! Two’s a crowd! You get it? ♪ La la la la la la la ♪ Disappear! Don’t you see I’m busy? Hit the boulevard! ♪ La la la la la la ♪ ♪ La la la la la ♪ ♪ This time it’s really love ♪ ♪ Tra la la ♪ ♪ I’m in that blue above ♪ ♪ Tra la la la ♪ ♪ She fills me full of joy ♪ ♪ Tell me papa ♪ ♪ Am I not a lucky boy ♪ ♪ Tra la la la la ♪ ♪ Just listen to my heart go pit pat ♪ ♪ It started from the start ♪ ♪ I fell like that ♪ ♪ Hum it strum it sing it drum it ♪ ♪ What a thrill I’m getting from it ♪ ♪ Tra la la la la la la ♪ ♪ This time it’s really love ♪ ♪ Tra la la la ♪ ♪ To me you’re full of blah blah blah ♪ ♪ I’ve got a grand amor ♪ ♪ Ooh la la la la oui ♪ ♪ She’s got for everything ♪ ♪ Is there a dowry ♪ ♪ She’s like a breath of spring ♪ ♪ Wow you’ll be sorry ♪ ♪ Hum it strum it sing it drum it ♪ ♪ Nothing good can happen from it ♪ ♪ Tra la la la la la la ♪ ♪ Tra la la la la la la ♪
Look! One hand!
Whoo!
Rah! Rah! Sis boom bah!
Rah! Rah! Sis boom bah!
[Both] Swing your partner with a tra la la!
Hum it!
Hum it!
Strum it!
Strum it!
Sing it!
Sing it!
Drum it!
Drum it! ♪ What a thrill I’m getting from it ♪ ♪ Oh tra la ♪ ♪ La la la la ♪
CLIP ENDS
- Okay, thanks. If we can just hold it there, Lauren. Thank you. So it’s a couple of things here for me is, I mean, just on a tiny small note, you know, he’s almost trying to use Gene Kelly trying to use his feet to copy the movements of Oscar Levant on the piano in his hands and fingers, which is a subtle piece thrown in with the choreography every now and then. The big point again, they are feeding off each other all the time. It’s not just, again, the virtuosity of Gene Kelly’s dance, Oscar Levant’s brilliance with the piano, but they’re looking at each other, they’re glancing at each other. They’re G'ing each other up to get more and more. Oscar Levant starts out, you know, all depressed and sad and he can’t get the whatever playing right. He doesn’t even want to, he doesn’t want to engage with Gene Kelly. But once he gets into, he gets in, and they start to really just give each other as actors and give each other in terms of the characters. And that makes for me such a powerful, beautiful theatrical scene because of the relationship that is created, not just the brilliance of each other’s artistic ability, dancing and playing. The other thing about it is Oscar Levant is got a, for me, is got a kind of curious, almost like a sadness, but a charm with the sadness. And I know I’m pushing the idea of charm and grace, but there’s something of this that feeds through the whole movie, and I think it takes it into another whole level, as I mentioned, because Roger Ebert and quite a few other critics have attacked “An American in Paris,” saying it’s nowhere near as good as, you know, the other great, remarkable, brilliant classic, “Singing in the Rain.”
And you know, what Fred Astaire and others are achieving there compared to what’s achieved here, I think it’s a bit of an unfair comparison, but I think it’s this quality of the music of Gershwin that is really underestimated, and this ability of the actors to constantly feed off each other, it’s, you know, in all the different ways. And it’s a celebration through art of music, dance, song. It’s a celebration through art that the joyousness comes through, or you know, the moment of joyousness, even if it’s just a moment in life, you know, okay with a bit of a love story and so on. And yes, of course, again, it’s tame, it’s schmaltzy, it’s naively romantic, all of that. But it’s the artistry of the music, the song, the dancing, that for me takes it that whole level further. And I think Gershwin is really aware of the power of the combination in musical theatre and in music itself. There’s a lot written about comparing “Singing in the Rain” with “An American in Paris.” We’re going to hold it there with that. Okay? And I want to go on to two last songs of Gershwin’s, which everybody hums maybe once a week, once every few weeks, whatever. People I think all over the globe know. And this is Ella Fitzgerald, Louis Armstrong, “They Can’t Take That Away From Me.” If we could play it, please, Lauren?
CLIP BEGINS
♪ The way you wear your hat ♪ ♪ The way you sip your tea ♪ ♪ The memory of all that ♪ ♪ No no they can’t take that away from me ♪ ♪ The way your smile just beams ♪ ♪ The way you sing off key ♪ ♪ The way you haunt my dreams ♪ ♪ No no they can’t take that away from me ♪ ♪ We may never, never meet again ♪ ♪ On the bumpy road to love ♪ ♪ Still I’ll always, always keep the memory of ♪ ♪ The way you hold your knife ♪ ♪ The way we dance 'til three ♪ ♪ The way you’ve changed my life ♪ ♪ No no they can’t take that away from me ♪ ♪ No they can’t take that away from me ♪ ♪ The way you wear your hat ♪ ♪ The way you sip your tea ♪ ♪ The memory of all that ♪ ♪ No no they can’t take that away from me ♪ ♪ The way your smile just beams ♪ ♪ The way you sing off key ♪ ♪ The way you haunt my dreams ♪ ♪ No no they can’t take that away from me ♪ ♪ We may never, never meet again ♪ ♪ On the bumpy road to love ♪ ♪ Still I always, always keep the memory of ♪ ♪ The way you hold your knife ♪ ♪ The way we dance 'til three ♪ ♪ The way you changed my life ♪ ♪ No no they can’t take that away from me ♪ ♪ No they can’t take that away from me ♪
[Louis] Swing it boys. ♪ We may never, never, never, never meet again ♪ ♪ On the bumpy road to love ♪ ♪ Swing it Ella ♪ ♪ Still I’ll always, always keep the memory of ♪ ♪ The way you hold a knife ♪ ♪ The way we dance 'til three ♪ ♪ The way you changed my life ♪ ♪ No no they can’t take that away from me ♪ ♪ No they can’t take that away from me ♪
[Louis] Will you repeat that again dearie, please? ♪ No they can’t take that away from me ♪
CLIP ENDS
- Thanks. I’m going to play the other one in a moment. Sometimes I think art really reaches the stars occasionally with two of the most remarkable artists of the century. They just take it and put it right up there in the heavens. And I’m being romantic here myself and I’m going over the top here. I don’t care. I think if one can’t appreciate what these two are doing, it’s extraordinary what Ella Fitzgerald and put her together with Louis Armstrong. And, you know, it just takes us into another world. Moments of reprieve, of respite for a couple of moments. It’s remarkable. And it all comes from Gershwin. We can never forget it. And he’s so able to get inside their, what I’m going to call their African-American heritage and understand something so profoundly deep, whether we call it some sort of suffering or some sort of pain and, you know, ways of overcoming adversity with courage and many other things, a certain lightness, a certain joy in the face of serious adversity. I don’t think Gershwin ever forgets that for a second. Okay. If we can play the last piece, please. From, you know, one of his, for me, one of one of his really great pieces, “Porgy and Bess,” and of course maybe the song that even transcends the last one.
CLIP BEGINS
♪ Summertime ♪ ♪ And the livin’ is easy ♪ ♪ Fish are jumpin’ ♪ ♪ And the cotton is high ♪ ♪ Oh your daddy’s rich ♪ ♪ And your ma is good lookin’ ♪ ♪ So hush little baby ♪ ♪ Don’t you cry ♪ ♪ One of these mornings ♪ ♪ You going to rise up singing ♪ ♪ Yes you spread your wings ♪ ♪ And you take to the skies ♪ ♪ But ‘til that morning ♪ ♪ There’s nothing can harm you ♪ ♪ Yes with daddy and mommy ♪ ♪ Standin’ by ♪ ♪ Summertime ♪ ♪ And the livin’ is easy ♪ ♪ Fish are jumpin’ ♪ ♪ Oh yeah ♪ ♪ And the cotton is high ♪ ♪ Oh your daddy’s rich ♪ ♪ Daddy’s rich ♪ ♪ And your ma is good lookin’ ♪ ♪ And your ma is good lookin’ ♪ ♪ So hush little baby ♪ ♪ Oh yeah ♪ ♪ Baby, don’t you cry ♪ ♪ Oh don’t you cry ♪ ♪ Oh don’t you cry ♪ ♪ Don’t ♪ ♪ Oh don’t you cry ♪ ♪ You cry ♪ ♪ Oh don’t you cry ♪
CLIP ENDS
Thanks, and just in closing, before we can go into a couple of questions, sometimes art really is a meteor that gleams an instant, then maybe is gone, but it can reach these moments. And if anybody isn’t, you know, I feel if people aren’t moved by what these two are doing with this kind of song, it’s quite incredible. And it’s all again coming from George Gershwin, absorbing, taking so much, putting it together, and taking it all so much further with a boldness and a sureness of touch, which comes from a belief as an artist, really. And I guess in the end, what I wanted to say about “An American in Paris,” of course it’s schmaltzy, of course it’s a bit tame, as some of the critics have said, yes, of course it’s a bit over romantic and nostalgia, you know, all that stuff, that’s kind of obvious in a way. But I think one misses then the sheer brilliance of the music, the artistry, the dance, the song, the music, the words, and it’s not simplistic. I think it’s deceptively simple, and utterly, utterly moving. I just want to say before going on to a couple of questions is, as we come to the end of this year, thank you so much to Wendy and to Lauren, Emily, Judy, everybody and all, everybody else who’s part of the gang who lectures us, you know, lectures every week, and all the visitors and the guests, and to Wendy and Trudy’s incredible hard work, and Judy and Lauren and and Emily, the hard work everybody puts in. And Kylie. I cannot say how much I appreciate, and most of all, how much I appreciate everybody who has been here on a Saturday or whenever to listen and to share, not only intellectual and historical ideas from me personally, but to celebrate something of art which comes through theatre or poetry or novels or music from Elvis to Ella to Fitzgerald to Louis Armstrong to Dylan, whoever! It doesn’t matter. And for me, ultimately it’s the art that can give us a moment to glance at perhaps something going on in our society or lacking in our society that enriches and inspires, I think, so much. So, thank you. And I’m going to hold in my slightly excessive use of words today. Okay. Going to some questions.
Q&A and Comments:
Thanks.
Q: So Marilyn, what was it that enabled the children of those Jewish immigrants to reach such high artistic heights in America?
A: That’s a great, great question. And of course the eternal question with the Holocaust is, you know, how many millions more, not only the cure for cancer, maybe, but you know, how much more would we have been enriched in terms of culture and art? Anything from architecture to business to whatever, you know, painting, anything. I think there is something about being the outsider and being the psychological and practical immigrant that, and you have to adapt to a culture of course, but you bring so much with you, and you celebrate the culture, but you’re also trying to adapt. And I think in that hustle and bustle going on inside people, there’s a fascinating mix, which can result in this kind of work of such artistic heights. And of course you need a certain amount of democratic and social freedom to do it. So you allowed to, you can just blossom. You don’t have to follow 25 years in the Russian Tsars army like Gershwin’s grandfather, or my grandfather and, or what he escaped from anywhere, you know, getting away from, and I’m sure many, many others. I have to mention, I named my daughter Ella, after after Ella Fitzgerald.
Okay, Victoria, I’d like a photograph of Prague. Bye. Thank you. Yeah, that’s Prague, the Charles Bridge. Absolutely. Thank you. An extraordinary piece of, I’m sure many people have seen it.
Barbara, “Porgy and Bess,” now standard repertoire of the American opera stages, the Met, Chicago, yeah, absolutely. I remember studying it cause I studied- I was on a Fulbright scholarship studying at Columbia where I did my post-grad and they, we had this teacher who was obsessed with it, and we studied it for weeks on end, in such depth and detail, from Gershwin’s music to the lyrics to everything about “Porgy and Bess” and the whole history of it. Everything. It’s one of the things that, one of the few, that I may remember from the course that he taught us, this is going way back to the late 80s. And I think it stood the test of time without a doubt.
Q: Harold, is anything Jewish in any of Gershwin’s compositions?
A: I think that would be another whole talk, Harold. And a fascinating question. I would say yes. And I would bring it from not an obvious perspective, but a more cultural, and this again, this outsider perspective. You know, when I identify with Kamoo, speaking about him last week, and I’m going to talk about Piaf in the next few weeks and Sartre even, the anti-Semetic and the Jew, I think there is something about being marginal or being on the outside of a society, but forced to adapt, or willingly wanting to adapt, and a sense of a bit more freedom than where the place ones come from. Just in a nutshell. And of course there’s a hell of lot more in the Jewishness of the compositions than going to the music, but that would be another time.
Susan, “An American in Paris” opened on Broadway in 2015. Yeah, I’ve read it, I didn’t see it, but I read about it and it looked fantastic, as you’re saying, Susan.
Q: Judy, the bed he hoisted, where can you get one? I want one.
A: I know, I thought of that as well. You know, it’s, and it’s done with such grace and charm, just, you know, it’s taken in in the movement, course he’s a dancer, so, you know, they do it. But still, you know, how do you play with it, that object?
Okay, let me just go back here. Just one second. I’m just going to get back to the question. This is just- sorry, jumping here. Okay. “An American in Paris,” the bed he hoisted. Yep. Just getting back to the questions.
Q: Sarah, what was Gershwin’s relationship with non-Jewish composers?
A: Well, as far as I know, I mean, he died very young, we have to remember, 39 if I’m right, that he was just 39 years old when he died. But he was already huge in Hollywood and, you know, he was working with Fred Astaire and others. He really worked with Gene Kelly, sorry, that was Minnelli, but he’d worked with Fred Astaire, et cetera. So I think it was pretty high. And he also went to, when he was in Paris, he studied with a French composer, Ravel, and others. And they all said to him, don’t try and compose classically like us. Go and compose like Gershwin. In other words, they believed in his talent, but you know, more in musical theatre than in classical. So I think obviously amongst certain composers, there would’ve been enormous amount of mutual respect, probably, especially in Paris at the time, the mid 20s when he was there and in America.
Ron, I hope you will. I agree with you, Susan. Vastly superior to the film. Okay, interesting.
Yeah. Eileen, if I’m right, yeah, that was just an hour.
Four degrees of snow, minus three Fahrenheit in Michigan. My god. Okay. My cousin lives in Michigan. Ann Arbour, freezing. Okay. Yeah, it’s the end of the year, you know, let’s be a little lighter, let’s celebrate. There’s enough darkness around, as we all know, and we obviously, you know, will deal with that.
Susan, Gene Kelly’s dancing is unforgettable. It’s absolutely unforgettable because it looks, as all great artists, it looks so effortless, but of course it’s, you know, he sweated blood to get there. Looks so effortless, and he keeps it with, as I said, a grace, but always relating to the other actor in the scene. And that’s what gives such a chemistry between the two, whether other actors or little kids, you know, what, 4, 5, 7 years old, or you know, Oscar Levant, or whoever.
Mitzi, he seems very American, very self-confident. I’m not sure if you mean Gene Kelly or Gershwin.
Susan, “Rhapsody in Blue,” the gift that keeps on giving. Lovely way of putting it, Susan.
Barbara, you cannot listen to “Rhapsody in Blue” and not feel the emotion. The first, it’s stunning! Those first few notes. I agree, Barbara. Those first few notes I come back to again and again, you know, and I seldom can get to the end of the whole thing. What is 18 minutes or whatever, you know, come back to those first couple of minutes, those notes starting right up there and right down there.
You know, I find parallels with Mozart and others with playing with that duality where they start, you know, with almost two or three levels emotionally happening at the same time.
Sandra, who was a pianist, the Bernstein performance. I’ll check the pianist in the piece I just played you.
Okay Hazel, I’ll check that again. The pianist and orchestra of that particular version.
Rita, brilliant choreography. Yep. Gene Kelly actually choreographed quite a bit himself.
Romaine, I think Gene Kelly is the John Wayne of musicals, especially in this. Such a strong energy and it’s a subtle masculine energy that he brings in. Beautiful. Exactly. And carrying the storyline. Yeah, you’re absolutely right. He brings that in and taking the emotional, the story further. You’re right. I agree. Good point. Great point.
Q: Hannah, was Gene Kelly his own choreographer?
A: Yes. He choreographed most of these scenes. Might have had a bit of help here and there, but as far as I know, most of it.
Sonya, I saw “An American in Paris” on Broadway. This must have been the 2015 production, was transfixed, the dancing and the set were perfect, but Gershwin’s music. Yep. It’s the music ultimately. I mean, let’s be really honest, you know, this is the Lionel Messi, the Pele, the Maradona, you know, it’s the music that is under that that creates the whole thing.
Marilyn. Okay. Thank you, kind Mara. Yep. Forever music. Susan, thank you. I can for an hour. He spent it today and shared. Thank you, Susan.
Iris, many people don’t know that George Gershwin was a painter. Yes. I want you to go into some of that, but thought I’d rather just focus on the music. Spot on.
We have a- you have a drawing in your collection done by Gershwin? A portrait of his psychiatrist, Gregory Zilboorg. That’s amazing, Iris. That’s extraordinary. I’d love if you would email me a picture of it. I’d love it. Thank you. Or to share with Lockdown University. This is an amazing university. We have such connections and such extraordinary overlaps, you know, that happen all the time. Whether artistically, historically, or the Jewish aspect or any aspect. It’s amazing. Thank you, Iris.
Paige, Brando’s in “Guys and Dolls.” That’s it, Faye. Thank you. Such for me, such an amazing light. He could, I feel Brando could almost dance in snow, you know, with the way he is doing it there, without being a trained dancer like Gene Kelly.
Marion, and he also danced in the “Last Tango of Paris.” Absolutely, Marion. Fantastic movie. Oh, that would’ve been a movie to do, actually. Brilliant idea.
Rochelle. Thank you. Always loved Gershwin. Cold, dry in Toronto, where my dear sister lives. Great Rita. Thank you.
Rita, nothing wrong with schmaltzy in the post-rationalist times. I agree. A bit of schmaltz, a bit of delayed adolescent romance and nostalgia. Why the hell not, you know, laugh and enjoy it.
Hannah, Ella and Louis. What a combination. Thank you. Okay, thanks Hannah. Yeah, I thought to end the whole year with Ella and Louis. It was either that, or Elvis to be honest.
Esther, thank you for your kind comments. Carla. Thanks, Carla. Again, thank you and happy, healthy 2023 to you, Carla, and to everybody. Hannah, our teachers are stars. Yeah, thank you.
Neville! Hope you’re well. Neville, if only Gershwin had written also “A Frenchman in New York,” starring Yves Montand. That’s a great idea. “Frenchman in New York.” We could carry on having fun with all the different, you know, a Scotsman in Cape Town. Susan, Ella and Louis and Gershwin with the spirit of Fred Astaire. That’s it, to leave us with for the year.
Barbara, thank you. Esther, totally agree with this. Ella and Louis Armstrong, it’s the art of the song is extraordinary.
That voice of Ella’s? Incredible. And of course, Armstrong. And then, you know, his little instrument.
Nicki, thank you. Gail! Thank you so much and hope you well, Gail. And Joe Berg, staying safe and Happy Hanukkah to you.
Rhoda, there’s a love of Gershwin. Yeah, that’s it. There’s Gershwin, there is Candinae, there’s Irving Berlin, I mean these guys are, you know this a hundred years later that Gershwin- Anyway, Rhoda, Oh Rhonda, oh thanks for that and hope you’re well in Toronto there, Rhonda.
Q: Judy, where are the melodies, the Brennan lyrics? Where have they all gone to?
A: Well Judy, start writing. You know, let’s all start doing it together. Have a massive lockdown university song and lamentation.
Sarah. Great. Thank you. Helen. All very kind comments.
Cultural appropriation. I wouldn’t, the PC.
Yeah, Gershwin is brilliant. He understood the music and the song on a pan human level. I agree entirely. Barbara, thanks for your kind comments.
Clara. Thank you. Judy, thank you.
And the black experience feeding in there, Judy. Yeah, thank you. He got it! And this, we’ve got to remember, this is in the 20s and the 30s he’s mostly doing his work. He gets right inside. This is way back before civil rights. Everything. He gets it, you know, in the way that Elvis got it in a totally different way, of course.
Monty, I was told the echoes of Eastern European Yiddish music. Yeah, as far as I know, from the work I’ve done, but I would need to talk to a real expert in Yiddish music. And I’m not. To really, not just come up with broad sort of phrases, but get into the detail. Monty, great point. Thank you.
Stan. All the best to you as well. Stan, for the new Rita, quintessential New York, Paris. Yep. Music, Experience. Francine, thanks. Susan. Thank you again.
“Summertime.” I had to have that as a finale. I couldn’t resist. Thank you, Susan.
Herbert, Gershwin’s very good friend with, was Schonberg. Yes, absolutely. He gave a very moving radio tribute to Gershwin after he died. Yep, he did. You know, with, aside from the Jewish connection, it’s absolutely, they got it. They understood each other completely.
Gail, thank you. Lorna, all very kind comments remain. Thank you. Daphne, cold and snowy is sandy. Detroit! Thank you.
Enjoy the schmaltz over over this Christmas period and everything. End of Hanukkah. Hannah, and best of you. To you, Hannah. Ruth, thank you. Dawn, much appreciate your kind comments.
Q: Pasca, don’t you think “Porgy and Bess” comes across as dramatic piece? The whole work gets hideous. The music is lively, but not the drama.
A: Interesting that. Yeah, I’ve, I mean I’m going back to, you know, the guy who taught me at Columbia all those years ago, who made up his- this was the exact debate we had all those years ago when I had long hair and was a student. He argued it, did have dramatic quality, but we’d have to go into that in detail and it’s way of seeing how to stage it and let the music drive the drama. That’s the key. ‘Cause there’s story in the music and the lyrics.
It’s Harut Beirut, thank you. And for the whole you- Thank you. Your kind comment.
Herbert, Oscar Levant wrote an hilarious book called, “Memoirs of An Amnesic.” Oh, fantastic. I didn’t know. Very funny. Thanks Herbert.
Myrna, Oscar Levant underrated. I agree. He suffered from depression. Yep. Yeah, he stole the scene. I think it’s the two of them together. But he certainly knew how to come up to Gene Kelly’s level. Happy Hanukkah to you as well, Ben.
Great. Linda. I had a studio flat in Paris in the 60s. I’m jealous, Linda. Which was so much like the one in the opening scene in “An American in Paris.” Yeah, they got it. I mean this Minnelli setting it in the early 50s you know, shortly after the war. But he gets it, and adding in those touches, which I think come from Toulouse-LeTrec, some of the other artists of the time, the designers in Paris, which Minnelli, you know, he understood in the stage design.
The set design. Lou, thank you so kindly. Carol. Thank you.
Roberta, Richard Rogers refused to listen to Gershwin’s music, according to Mary Rogers, the daughter. I didn’t know. That’s fascinating. Thanks. Linda.
Recently PBS presented “Dreaming of a Jewish Christmas.” Oh god, that is brilliant. “Dreaming of a Jewish Christmas.” That’s a great line. Thanks for that, Linda. Featuring the Gershwin’s, who adapted contributed to American life and music. Yeah.
Bernard said when Gershwin asked Ravel for instruction, Ravel said, why be a second class Ravel when you’re a first class Gershwin. That’s the phrase. Thanks Bernard, for reminding- That’s the exact phrase.
Barbara, “The Crying Clarinet.” That’s what it is at the top of the reps is klezmer? Oh, okay. Great. Thank you for that 'cause that’s always what’s gripped me so much at the beginning. Janet, thank you. Diane, been eyeing the photo of the Charles Bridge. Okay. It’s many memories of the trip.
Yeah, Vivian, thank you. And also to you, and yeah, the Brando was absolutely with Maria Schneider in “Last Tango in Paris.” It’s a great idea to do as a movie.
Q: Nina, if he had lived longer, do you think he would’ve been influenced by his contemporaries? Stravinsky, Schoenberg, Ravel, Prokofiev.
A: Yeah. They all told him not to change. I think they would’ve carried on saying, you know, in the phrase that you mentioned from Ravel, don’t be a second rate Ravel, be a first rate Gershwin. Carry on what you’re doing with all the American influences of jazz melody, you know, the black American, all of that coming in there.
The wailing clarinet, Sandra, is like klezmer. Yep. Brilliant. Thanks for that connection, Sandra.
Paula, in the film’s instrumental music for me, the lyrics are always implied. Gene Kelly, the dance, “Our Love is Here to Stay.” Yeah. And never write words with too many syllables 'cause when you sing, it goes on longer. And you know, Ira Gershwin understood it completely all those years ago.
Betty, beginning of “Rhapsody in Blue” is klezmerish. Thank you. You’ve all made that connection. I didn’t make it. That’s brilliant. Thank you. Francis. Appreciate.
Ronna. Molly, Gene Kelly. Sorry I just jumped here a little bit. Maybe just go back. They lived there. “Rhapsody in Blue.” Okay.
Ronna, the Met wanted to use only white actors in blackface with “Porgy and Bess,” and Gershwin said no. Huh? Specified had to be cast of black performers only. Makes absolute sense. Not only was he, he understood it, let’s just put it that way. He understood completely what to do.
Francine, I hear the influence of Jewish music in the clarinet solo in his music. Klezmer wails, almost crying clarinet. Fantastic phrase. Thank you Francine, and everybody for mentioning that.
Molly, Gene Kelly’s apartment. It’s so full of funny delights. That’s the thing, it’s opening scene, but all these little funny little quirky things. It’s just fun to play with, you know, in the opening of a movie.
Q: And then Bernard, other than Cole Porter, what other non-Jewish composer are there?
A: I get the joke, Bernard.
Q: Aubrey, have you heard Yuja Wang play “Rhapsody in Blue” on YouTube?
A: No, I haven’t. I’ll look it up. Thanks for that, Aubrey.
Q: George, was this Leslie Caron’s first film?
A: I’m actually not sure. I need to check that. I’ll check it. Thank you.
Gene. Thanks. Appreciate. Howard! Ah, my cousin! My wonderful cousin in Washington. Hope you’re well, Howard, and have a fantastic break now near Hanukkah, et cetera, okay. And call me sometime, Howard, please.
Rose, “American in Paris,” London West End in 2017. Saw it. Great.
Susan, “Rhapsody in Blue” up in Woody Allen film, “Manhattan.” Yep, that’s what I said. And everyone in the theatre broke out in applause! Okay. Oh fantastic. And he got it, Woody.
Q: Day field, why “Rhapsody in Blue?”
A: Well, blues the blues. I’m feeling blue.
Stewart, great presentation. Okay. Thank you.
Barbara, under fire, “grausvicci”, I think your saying. Okay, thanks. Yep. Always go back to Kamoo in the depths of winter. I came to understand the invincible summer in my heart. Laney. Thank you.
Judy, the clarinets, they said high melancholy. Yep. The ectasy had a klezmercology. You’ve all said.
Susan, Michael Tilson Thomas did a PBS programme? Oh, okay. I’ll look at that. Thank you.
The Jewish influence in music. Shareholder I think was the name. Yep. It’s okay. It’s a pleasure. You saw Ella Fitzgerald in Houston in the 80s. Fantastic.
Ron, Gershwin didn’t write the opening notes of “Rhapsody in Blue.” It was improvised by the clarinettist. Gershwin liked it so much that he was- Okay. That’s fascinating, Ron. Thank you for that.
Q: Okay. And then Lou. Isn’t Oscar Peterson play Gershwin?
A: Yep. He’s also an extraordinary collection of jazz classics by Oscar Peterson and Itzhak Perlman. And it’s called… God, what’s it called? I’m trying to remember the name, but if you can, you can Google it. Oscar Peterson and Itzhak Perlman playing a number of jazz classics. Just the two of them together. And I love it. I’ve listened to it so often. It’s brilliant. I’ll try and remember the name of the whole album.
Q: Phyllis, anything about the relationship between the brothers?
A: Sure. That’ll be great to go into. But for another whole, another time from what we know.
Joel, thank you. Gita, if that schmaltz that’s all over Judy schmaltzy 2023. Okay. Okay. When in doubt, have a bit of schmaltz with delicious chocolate.
Okay, so thank you very much everybody, and thank you again, Lauren. I hope you all have a fantastic, healthy, safe New Year, and a bit of fun and a bit of joy. And see everybody in January. Take care.